For all of you theologians who want to meet good Reformed girls, here's a new pickup line:

To Lima Team

How cool! It's AWESOME to know what's going on in the Dinosaur world...and yours at this moment. =) Does Thomas get to be a special dinosaur? Are Lima dinosaurs different? Heh heh...^_^

It's great to know what's going on out there. Keep us informed whenever you can! Godspeed - our prayers are with you!

Well, this was unexpected...

So, on my post with a whole lot of different topic ideas, I included a topic about cats:
"I do not like cats. They are a curse upon the world, and must be extinguished."

Now, on BoarsHeadTavern.com, they're talking about cats.

Hmm... well, that was unexpected...

Ok, all of you, I don't care what you are doing, Go to www.boarsheadtavern.com and read the interesting discussion they are having on girly lyrics in worship music. No, really, Go. Go now. Stop reading this. Dammit, ... here let me help you, just click here.

Peru?

Jason: When I think of you going to Peru, somehow I think of that VeggieTales song where Larry has the large sombrero and sings. Don't ask me why, I don't know.

Gummichild: I think I tried to make the distinction that small groups can work when there's someone in there who knows their relevant theology cold. I might have forgotten. Anyway, such is my experience that having someone knowledgable helps. However, it is also my experience (in college) that given no idea of how a small group is actually supposed to function (from the Church), confused brothers and sisters come together to try and learn something through small group bible studies. By the nature of these groups, there isn't a single theologically experienced person. The result is a group of people, some of whom don't understand exegesis or how to interpret scripture, some who think they know but are misapplying what they learned from studying Emily Dickinson, some who might really know but don't speak up, and maybe some people like myself who have some feeling for it but honestly are not probably the best people for the job but inevitably voice themselves the most.

In a way, the small group has also become a misused crutch for people who don't read the bible alone. For whatever reason, the bible simply isn't read (I'm guilty of this for extended periods of time). When one person comments that they are failing in this area, another chimes in and they suggest maybe they could read together. However, inevitably this doesn't turn out to simply be reading the scripture and soaking it in, but another example of attempted group exegesis.

There needs to be some direction from the Church, regardless of denomination, on how to properly run a small group (both for leaders and the lead). As it stands I haven't seen much effort being put into explaining the proper way to talk about scripture amoungst one another. While perhaps we should not contrain the small group so far into becoming a small group Sunday school, I certainly think the leader should be somewhat authoritative, if only to avoid misguided notions and conclusions. However, often the leader is more concerned with making the scripture and themselves approachable, or is more concerned with something beyond maintaining theological soundness.

I no longer know where I'm going with this, and I have to go to work now. Anyway, enjoyable discussion, and don't take my nitpicking the word "against" too seriously. I'm just like that, and it's not something I'm offended by or intended to offend by. :)

Jason/Thomas: God speed, and may the light of our Lord be with you as you travel abroad. :D

Emily

In general, dogs are more attention-loving, and need you to care for them. It's that need that creates that bond between owner and dog .I'm only hypothesizing, as I've never had a dog, but have always wanted one; I'm also basing this on past pets I've had - goldfish, pigeons (which, uh, we ate...I didn't know till college that we ate them when I was little!!! Oy...we're so Chinese...>_<), an alligator lizard (skink), a few grasshoppers, a praying mantis, a beta fish...and more recently, a scaley headed pionus parrot that flew away, and currently, 87, our California desert tortoise.

If I was to have a dog, I'd like one of those little terrier types. Intelligent and fun. =) A bigger dog...I'd only make exceptions for labradors/retrievers. =)

The best pet I've had was Emily though. She was the smartest, most beautiful parakeet that ever existed in the world. Yep. ^_^

Philosophical adventures in Love

Hello all.

I have been finding myself quite philosophical as of late, and I would like to know what you all think on certain subjects. What is the proper, Christian view to take on such subjects, in your opinion?

Meditations on Love
More on Love (from my online journal, from oldest to newest):
(Note: I cannot guarantee that I fully agree with the me of the past on some of these topics)
- Love is such a curious thing
- More on Love
- On Biblical Love, Romance, Infatuations, and Teeth like Sheep...
- On Physical Attraction and Love
- Analyzing "love", from inside and out, and other thoughts...

Hmm, there are other topics I'd like to discuss, but lets stick with this one for now. Any thoughts?

Oh, and could someone please, please, start on that topic of cats?

Group Leaders, Peru, and SoCal

Matoushin:

Hi hi! =) By no means was I specifically referring to you when I was commenting earlier, heh heh...nor was I posting anything "against" anyone...so if it seemed like it, then I do apologize! Heh heh...those that know me in person know that I hardly am one to argue in such a way. I don't really debate in terms of arguing against another person. I just share my thoughts on what someone else may have said, if I think differently, or if I think there's more to be said on something, and I think I was more just adding onto your thoughts with more thoughts that were in my head.

That's one thing I don't like about online stuff: people can't hear tone, and they may just take things the wrong way, or make assumptions about what was typed (these were part of the problems why onecross died, and why some people seemed to take offense about certain things, and why at least one person left rather angry from the discussions that were on there, as great as those discussions were...), or the way that it was typed, especially if one doesn't know typing etiquette (I had one parent all year that liked to type in CAPS ALL THE TIME AND WITHOUT PUNCTUATION SO THAT EVERY TIME I GOT AN EMAIL FROM HER IT FELT LIKE SHE WAS SCREAMING AT ME IN ONE BREATH BUT THAT WAS NOT THE CASE BECAUSE MOST OF THE TIME SHE WAS THANKING ME FOR THIS OR THAT OR ASKING ME FOR THIS OR THAT. ^_^).

They were just statements in general. From what it seems like here, you don't seem like one to church-hop anyways or to not do something about a problem (hey, if you were one of those types, you proooobably wouldn't have been posting here on such topics here, right?). =) And I agree with you - there are churches that fail in what they need to do, whether it's in terms of leadership, shepherding, etc...and sometimes, a church may break apart for a reason that only God understands. In all paths, God already knows what the end-result will be. It's just a matter of how we all plan to get there...

Matoushin/Jason: Now, if a small group is simply teaching the Bible wrong, then there are problems. But realize that each person that is teaching should be qualified for it somehow, just like how, if you were the Sunday School Coordinator, you would choose Sunday School teachers that are suitable for doing the job well. Or choosing counselors for youth camp - I can't let anyone that just wants to do it, if they're not a Christian, do it. And even if they ARE a Christian, but let's say that they don't go to church much, don't practice living like a Christian, and don't make efforts to be like Christ...how can I let someone with those traits - even if he/she has repented of his/her sins, accepted Christ, and been baptized - be a counselor, a role model, and a teacher to youth about what God would want them to be like? Yes, there is a discrimination over who one chooses to put as a leader for those around that person.

And during small group, as a discussion, it's also not for one person to dictate the conversation. Everyone should have a chance to put forth their opinions, or at least form thoughts in their head. The leader should facilitate, but not dictate, the outcomes of their thoughts. But Truth is Truth, and if something's not right, someone should be stepping in, whether it's the facilitator or a member of the small group. If things are questionably interpreted, one can always go to the pastor, or extensively google it up and compare thoughts (but you all know how fallible that internet can be...heh heh...). We're humans, and we can't be perfect, can't be exactly right, at every moment of our lives. But small group leaders do have a responsibilty to extensively understand and research what it is that they are teaching, and even who they are teaching, and not just throwing it together last minute. If they don't fulfill their responsibilities in doing that, it may hurt those very ones that they are trying to help.

Jason/Thomas: You two are going to Peru this weekend!!! How exciting! Good luck, to both of you, on your endeavors in South America! May you find joy in serving the Lord there as you've had here in North America, heh heh, and if there are mosquitos...be careful! ^_^

On the topic of "Norcal > Socal":

SoCal Rocks. Sunnier dispositions and weather, and a happier climate all around. =) We're close to the beaches (snorkeling, kayaking, swimming, surfing!), mountains (snow, fishing, lakes, hiking), cities (for shopping - am I the only girl currently posting on this? If so, I expect no sympathy for shopping, ha ha...- and playing), and close to drive to national parks (hiking, climbing, river rafting, camping!!!), another country (Mexico), another state (Las Vegas - mmm...buffets...Circus Circus...), and a million other good things. ^_^

NorCal is a little too dreary for me. Been there...and though I DO like it (the charm of Fisherman's Wharf and buying fresh crab from Cantonese people who gave us a discount simply because we spoke Cantonese too, and meandering in Chinatown, as touristy as it is, was priceless!), I wouldn't want to live there. Sorry NorCal'ers. =)

Thus, for me, it would have to be: "SoCal > NorCal" ^_^

Any Thesauruses out there?

Har har, dinosaur pun. I'm so funny I don't see anyone else laughing (I'm going to assume it's because I'm laughing so hard).

Anyway...

Jason: Thanks for the defense. My only critique is your use of the word "against". Gummychild's reply was by no means "against" me. It was critiquing and in disagreement with what I said, but it certainly didn't wave signs claiming that I was hellbound and surely would be the destroyer of worlds etc.

Gummichild: I just want to be perfectly clear that I by no means endorse rampant church switching. From personal experience, doing so will leave one in rather turbulent waters in terms of faith and the understanding thereof due to a time of uncertaintly after each switch. In my case, I'm pretty sure God put me through that intentionally because I was far too comfortable where I had been, and needed some good ole' fashioned turmoil to get me moving.

Also, I'm definately not the kind of person to see a problem and do nothing about it. At each church I ended up leaving, I told someone in an important position (usually the pastor) how I felt. Sometimes it was merely a matter of doctrine, and after prayer found that I was not to stay where I had been. In a particular, and very sad case, the church was going somewhere that was completely against my heart, soul and mind and reponded less than half-heartedly to my concerns.

I won't name any names, but that particular church had three sermons in succession about how great their new, bigger and better church building was going to be. Sermons for crying out loud. I have no problem with a church mentioning church related issues in church, even in the service. It's probably the best time to bring up something that requires major funding like an entirely different church building. I was only minorly disturbed by the first "sermon", but when the next two had almost nothing to do with God or Christ as well and were simply about "what we should be doing so we can finish this nice new church building", I was more than disturbed. Between that and some other issues I was having with the particular church, leaving was necessary to preserve my faith.

*Matoushin comes to the realization he's rambling a bit*

To get back on topic, Jason defended me beautifully, and there isn't much more I can say specifically to that. I found a church at college that is the epitomy of awesome (so much so me and my roommate were compelled to cook dinner for the pastor and his wife one evening which, by the grace of God, was wonderful), and have stuck there since.

I'm here because I need fellowship with fellow Christians, and not ones who will necessarily agree with me. I have the unforunate problem of attracting people who largely agree with me, and I haven't figured out why yet. In any case, it is hard to be an honest Christian when one's secular friends know so little (and care even less, in fact getting livid at the mention of Jesus) and one's brothers and sisters in Christ are of the same mind one's doctrine is scarcely challenged, not to mention faith.

In any case, rest assured I don't advocate "shopping" for churches, or using them like some people use, uh, things you use once and throw away when you're bored. Additionally, I most definately advocate involvement in the church, and I think similarly towards government as well, and am generally of the opinion that if you have a problem with someone, something or anything and want to complain about it you have to also do something about it. If someone is complaining for complaining's sake, I usually call them on it and ask them if they are planning on talking to the person about it etc.

I should stop rambling now, before it's too late.

Jason (again): Keep up the dinosaur comics, they rock.

Rebelling Against Rebels?

I agree with Jason. Making those rules won't get those that don't post to post more, and only limits those that want to and appreciate posting here regularly on here. It's like trying to force the rebel kids in class that don't want to participate to participate in class discussion/activity and stopping those that really want to participate in class.

The rebels don't care if it affects their grade, because their grade is not their priority, thus, they still won't participate. The ones that WANT to participate then begin to see the class discussion/activity as stagnant or boring, want to jump in but are reprimanded when they do, and then they become angry, sullen, or lose faith in the purpose of that discussion/activity altogether.

Plus, this is not a classroom where all the members are physically present together in one location. Some members may not have read this site in a while - I know I didn't when I was gone for a week and some on vacation, right? =)

concerning comments:
If you guys want, I can set it up so that whenever someone makes a new post or a comment, you will get an email notification. Of course, I would still prefer to have our conversations in the main "room" of the tavern (heheh) rather than in the comment threads.

Oh, and for all of the quiet members out there, I would still love to hear your thoughts. But, in case you don't know what to talk about, here are some ideas (not necessarily those of the author) that you can respond to. Oh, and (to make things interesting) you can only discuss these topics if:
1) You have posted less than 5 times total, and no one else has started the discussion. That means me, Jason, Matoushin, and Albert cannot start a discussion on these.
2) You have posted 5 or more times, but someone has already began a discussion.
3) You have posted 5 or less times.
4) You are a visitor on the site. (Leave a comment.)

SO, that means if any of us talkative folks want to talk about these things, we need to wait for someone else to talk about them, or we need to urge others to discuss them (member or visitor).

OK, here's the topics:
- "Modern worship music may sound great, but it really lacks in theological content, and therefore should not be sung in churches, fellowships, etc.."
- "'Left Behind' and despensational premillenialism are crap as eschatological views, and are the result of bad readings of the Bible (bad exegesis and hermeneutics)."
- "Christian -> Republican."
- "The emergent church movement is dangerous and should be opposed by all real Christians."
- "I do not like cats. They are a curse upon the world, and must be extinguished."
- "Reformed theology is the theology most faithful to the texts of the Bible."
- "Dave Fong should grow his hair back." (Related: "Jason should stay bald.")
- "John Piper's Christian Hedonism is a dangerous movement in modern theology."
- "Young Earth Creationism is the only valid reading of the creation texts."
- "Small groups suck." (See here)
- "Linux > Mac > Windows."
- "Homosexuality is not morally wrong, and all these Conservative jerks are just being mean and unloving and Pharisaical."
- "Joel Osteen is brilliant and represents the best of Christianity."
- "Norcal > Socal."
- "Christians need to learn to stop using their own Christian lingo all the time."
- "Catholics are really Christians too."

Ok, all you quiet people: time to start talking. My hands are now tied, so please start something here.

Honey Nut Cheerios

Matoushin: I know what you mean in this post, though for me, it was more of a whole church thing, and not a small group thing. Twice, I almost left my church. And twice, God yanked me right back. =) Perhaps that's a story for another time.

But meanwhile, your post, as well as past experiences, have put the following thoughts together:

Isn't this posting a form of small grouping? Perhaps not, as we're not fully all on out putting forth our Bibles out, opening up to Scripture, and saying this is what this is saying, etc...But a small group also allows for people to form closer bonds to each other as Christian brotha's and sista's, to form that support group that Christians do need. We do need to know that there is someone we can turn to, to either ask for advice, or just speak to, when the time is needed, and someone that we know can keep us accountable for who we are supposed to be.

Theoretically, that is what it's mainly supposed to do, right? Of course, we ain't perfect - we're human and full of errors, and there may instead be drama, anger, jealousy, and all those things that do not show our love to each other as children of God. We're a little stupid and prone to these mess ups. However, that's why as Christians, we need each other - to imitate and be like Christ, to see examples of others doing this, to be role models for others, and as said earlier, to support each other in this way.

We can't fellowship with Christ without fellowshipping with our fellow Christians.Being in a small group is one thing. Leading is another. One of our calls as Christ's children is to serve one another. The answer (to me) to the meaning of life is to serve God, and in doing so, you become a part of that church.You can't see a problem, and not try to fix it (oh wait, note - this in no way directly applies to you, Matoushin, as I don't know you except through here. ^_^ It's a general statement that I'm making based on what I've seen happen here and there. ^_^), and then say, well, this is not for me, and leave. Sometimes, it's God's will to move one to another church, but moving away is not the only option when things are inadequate and needs aren't met.

It's serving to fill the void or need that you see, and doing what you can, and getting others to join you in this mini-crusade, to take care of it. When people serve, they then have a purpose and need to be at that the church, and oftentimes, God will show you how you matter and what differences you can make when you let Him use you. You won't be able to see all the ripples you make in the water though - that's for God to know and reveal, right?

If people don't serve, what purpose do they have to be there? The church can only give so much as the people in the church want to give. To give is to receive, right?

If everyone at church stepped away when they saw their need wasn't being met, nothing would ever get done.

If everyone stepped in, karazy-koolness could ensue.

It's like that saying about how a single snowflake doesn't do much...but a snowstorm can stop traffic.

Worthy?

Hi! =) This is Gail! =)

I'm back from vacation, so I can post now. =)

I had a thought this morning. You know that phrase, "worthy of our praise"? And how God alone is worthy of our praise? Well...just a thought, ya know...what makes us think that we are so great, that He has to be worthy of our praise? Like...it's as if we're so good and great that finally, finally, we've found something that can exceed our greatness, and thus, He's worthy to be praised. But it ain't like that. Cuz we're just human, and technically, we're scum.

So sometimes, when that phrase is found in songs, it nags me, just a little. But not too much - it's the praising Him that I like, and not so much the words. It ain't worth it (that "worth" again!) to go nuts over one phrase and decide not to sing it or praise it out loud like a fat boy loves cake. (Or a skinny boy for that matter - cake is intrinsically good. ^_^)

God's worthy to be praised just cuz He is. He IS da bomb-diggety, tha's fo' sho'...^_^

Nuts to you

Jason badgered me into reading an article about small groups and the failings thereof. It's an interesting read, and very much in line with how I've felt about small groups for a while.

Basically, aside from some friends of mine at college who knew their theology dead solid, meeting in a small group bible study was a lesson in people applying assumptions and preconceptions to specific verses without context. Nothing grew, aside from the plethora of verses to cite when backing up one's own conception of Christianity.

It's literally building a house on the sand. Even if you know something of God and Christ already, even being on speaking terms, there's nothing to cling to but sand and waves. Without the community of the church as a guide, you could quite wrongly exegete anything.

What specifically bugs me is that small groups make up 90% of how scripture is taught in many churches. When small groups are inadaquate, people simply muddle about in confusion and complacency because, well, what else are they supposed to do? When the church itself isn't teaching scripture, where do you go?

The answer? A different church. It's what I've done in the past when a Church isn't teaching me about Christ and scripture. And sadly, I went through a half dozen churches in this fashion when I went to college.

Ambiguity

Jason: Your thoughts on movies remind me very much of my feelings towards Anime.

Basically, I love Anime, but more specifically I love the Anime series or movies that leave things ambiguous more than ones that spoon-feed me everything. Magic Knight Rayearth was a fun romp through a magical world, but in the end I never had to think about anything at all. I was spoon-fed mindless adventure after adventure. RahXephon was very different from that, leaving large holes for me as the viewer to fill and speculate on. While some of the holes were filled by the story later, it was fun to speculate on them while I could, and see how I did. It is still fun to speculate about the remaining holes which were left behind.

What it boils down to is that the anime that do the best in my sight are the ones that make room for the viewer to think, to speculate, to be given some revelations but withheld others, to wonder how I fit in, and left ambiguity inside.

It is important to note that too much ambiguity, or an inability to relate to important characters, can be just as bad as spoon-feeding. Neon Genesis Evangelion was such an Anime for me. I couldn't relate to the ultra-depressed main character, Shinji, and the ending (with or without the End of Evangelion movie) was so ambiguous it was hardly worth watching twenty six episodes of a series to build up to. The story ended up being so full of holes it couldn't keep shape and fell apart for me. It went from being something I could speculate about to being something I had to practically write myself.

In any case, let's hope more movies that allow one to think come out. I'm still hoping to see Howl's Moving (or was it Magic?) Castle before it drops out of theatres.